SPEAKER_01: 0:04

When I would turn in papers, especially in Japan, I studied in Japan and it was all in Japanese. That was hard turning in papers and knowing that I wasn't born Japanese, so it was really hard to do. So imagine coming to the States, for example, like you, and um, you know, writing in English, and also if you're writing a book, for example, that's kind of a scary thing. And there is an imposter system, uh, imposter syndrome, and it is real. So, what I do is I help them um realize that most people have not done what they've done. Most people have not come from another culture and you know, started writing and really writing for an audience and you know, seriously taking this too.

SPEAKER_00: 0:46

Hi, friends. This is Read and Write with Natasha Podcast. My name is Natasha Tines, and I'm an author and a journalist. In this channel, I talk about the writing life, review books, and interview authors. Hope you enjoy the journal. Hi everyone, and welcome to another episode of Read and Write with Natasha. Today I have with me Dr. Anne Randerson, who is uh a Brussels-based writer, writing coach, and former university lecturer in mindfulness and global leadership. She teaches online creative writing courses for San Diego Writers, Inc. and supports writers worldwide through her coaching practice cross-cultural horizons. Anne has published two novels under a pseudonym and is currently working on her third. All right, and so happy to finally connect with you online and have you on my podcast. I'm very impressed by all your work that you're doing, and I cannot wait to talk about it today. And first, I'd like to ask you about your books. Uh, what are these books and um what is the third book you're working on? So the floor is yours, Anne. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:06

Well, first of all, thank you, Natasha, for inviting me today. I'm very excited to be on your podcast. I've watched some episodes and they're very interesting. I just love it. Thank you for inviting me. Um, so my first one I'm going to show you. I don't know if uh people who are listening won't see this, but it's called Underwater Vibes. Um, it's um my pen name is Mickey Brent, and it takes place in Brussels, Belgium. And the sequel is Broad Awakening, which is a sequel to this book. And it also takes place in Brussels, Belgium, but also on Santorini Island in Greece. So Ah, nice. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What I could do is I could I could maybe read the would you like me to read the back of it? Because that might be easier to explain. Sure, yeah, yeah. Okay, so how did this survive that pivotal moment when admiration turns to attraction? Helen Dupont, a scientific translator in Brussels, Belgium, cherishes two things: flowers and her cat. She writes bad poetry to help her survive her painful existence with her husband until she is forced to undergo a radical lifestyle change. Sylvie Routard, a young Greek photographer, enters Helene's world as her private swim coach. During their daily lessons, Hélène's admiration towards Sylvie turns to attraction. As unsettling feelings hijack Hélène's body and mind, daydreams featuring Sylvie enter her world, even her poems. While the two athletes increasingly feel underwater vibes in the pool, Hélène questions her relationship at home and everything else in life. So that's the first book. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 3:36

Wow. So for me, reading about this, it seems that your novel is about like international citizens or citizens from all over the world. And that actually mirrors your story because from my understanding, you were born in the US, but you've been outside of the US for a long time. You're in Europe and you also teach international students. So I think my question is when it comes to having this international perspective, which is kind of similar to mine, I guess you can tell from the accent. Is who is your target audience when you write, right? Because whenever you publish, like who is your audience? For me, is like, is it Americans, expats, Europeans? Who do you have in mind? And who is most likely to purchase a book with such an international appeal?

SPEAKER_01: 4:28

Right. Well, yeah, that's a very good question. Um, so I was born in the States and I have lived abroad for most of my adult life, mainly in Brussels, Belgium, but I also lived in Asia and in other places in Europe, um, and also in Mexico for a while. So I write for an international audience. I feel like I'm a citizen of the world. So I'm writing for other people who have lived in many places like you and who are interested in different cultures and different backgrounds and different languages. Um, I majored in French, French linguistics when I was in college, and so there's a lot of French in my first two books, um, especially since they take place in Brussels. Um the Darganis, mainly women, mainly women reading my books, a lot of queer women reading my books as well, mainly in the United States, but also in the UK, and also actually in Africa. Um, some people have taken my books there a little bit underground because it is a story about two women falling in love, and they were passed around. I know in Kenya I gave um a former student of mine some of my, quite a few of my books, and they they got passed around and they ended up in South Africa and other places, and it's starting conversations. My idea is to help everyone understand that you know we're all humans and we're all connected and we're all citizens of the world wherever we live.

SPEAKER_00: 5:40

And do you think you mentioned most of the readers are in the US? Um uh which is intriguing because I was always under the impression, you know, probably I'm mistaken, is that when people use foreign language in the book, especially people in the US, it's it kind of turned them off and they cannot continue reading. I think because the US tend to be very US-centric and it's not like you're in Europe where you're exposed too many languages. And for me, I face that in my books because I throw a lot of Arabic and sometimes like how much Arabic is enough before people say, like, I cannot do this. You know, it's it's it's a lot of foreign language that that turns them off. Do you ever grapple with this?

SPEAKER_01: 6:22

Well, I I that's a great question because I actually love reading books in historical fiction and contemporary fiction, like what I write with other languages, because it helps me really understand the other cultures and really get into the story. So I just love that. I did get some responses on Goodreads. I noticed that at the beginning I was kind of crushed because I thought, you know, there's French in here because I thought Americans should learn French. So what I did was I put quite a few words in French, but I kept repeating the same words so that they would learn, you know. And some people really liked it, especially those who had studied French in school or who had gone to France or you know, Canada. But some people were saying there was too much French and they were kind of upset. So then I realized, okay, maybe I should scale back. And my next book now that I it's Spanished, actually, I'm looking for a new publisher, but um there's a lot of Spanish because there's a Mexican protagonist, so there's a lot of Spanish. But it takes place in California, in San Francisco, and I was raised pretty much bilingual English, Spanish, so I like having Spanish in the book. And too bad if people don't want to read it, because I I mean, I guess as the author, I just want it to be authentic and yeah, that's that's interesting.

SPEAKER_00: 7:25

As I told you, I'm always like worried about throwing Arabic words there. All right, but so your your books were do you had a publisher or did you self-publish? And how was the the publishing journey? Um, and I'm curious about publishing in Europe versus in the US.

SPEAKER_01: 7:42

Okay, well, um, it was a long publishing journey. Um, I had never written books before, so I started teaching writing here in Brussels in 2006. So I was teaching writing mainly to expats in English for many years, and I kept trying, I kept submitting, um, and didn't really find a publisher until I did. Took me 13 years, but I'm a bit of a perfectionist, so I rewrote my book 13 times. So at the beginning of every year in January, I would start over again and rewrite the book, every word, every sentence. I mean, a bit of a perfectionist. And I got a no. Um, but I kept on writing with the same publisher, and I kept on writing, and I went to a conference in San Diego and saw the publisher there, and I said, Oh, you rejected my book. And they said, Oh, yeah, well, we do that. You know, we do that usually we reject books. And they said, Are you still writing? And I said, Oh, yeah. I've written the book so many times since then. And they said, Is it better? And I said, Yeah, so much better. And they said, Submit it again, you never know. So I submitted, I waited about six months, and then I got this letter saying, Yes, we'll we'll take your book. And so that's how it started. But it took like 13 years. So if you're writing a book, everybody listening here, just keep going because hopefully you'll find your publisher. And they published that book and a sequel. And now I'm looking for a new publisher that's maybe more international. This publisher is traditional, they're based in New York. But I'm looking more international because I feel like there's there's I want to go wider, bigger. And um Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 9:07

Well, what a nice story. I really like that. It's the same publisher who rejected you, took on your story. It's very very inspiring. And so you also teach writing to expats, and how is that different? Like, do you customize the curriculum for an international audience, like versus if you're teaching the same curriculum to American students where where you were born? How would you shift it if to put it like in an international lens?

SPEAKER_01: 9:41

Yeah, that that's a good question, because I do teach both. At San Diego Writers Inc. right now, like I have a class on Friday, a workshop, and I do it online. They're mainly Americans there and mainly located in San Diego. Although I've bought some international friends who are coming from Austria and other countries in Europe, and um they've they've participated as well. When I was teaching in Brussels, it was mainly expassed and so I would make it more culturally oriented because they would write about, like I had a student for many years, they they kept taking the course. I had to keep revising it because they kept taking the course again and again. And she was from South Africa, and so she loved to write about her childhood and about um all the animals there and safaris and things like that. So we would look at each country, and I had a German student too that wrote about the German culture, and another, you know, and some of them wrote in their own languages too. So I had students who wrote in German, others who wrote in Italian, and others in different languages. And that was interesting when we would read together what we'd written each week, you know, what they'd written. And some of the languages I understood all the languages actually, luckily, but um some of the other participants didn't understand the languages, so it was kind of interesting. Wow. I taught at the European Commission and everyone was doing it in their own language, and then together at lunchtime, it was so much fun, and then they would read their work.

SPEAKER_00: 10:56

That's fascinating. Since you're based in Europe, I'm just curious about the reading culture in Europe versus the reading culture in in the US. So I I lived in London, I did my master's there, and I remember it was like the early 2000s, everyone on the train was reading. I think that's not the case now, because now it's everyone on their phone, but I haven't been to Europe in a while, so I'm not sure. But if you know you travel between both countries, how is the reading culture differ between those two countries? Especially now with the phone and and all the devices.

SPEAKER_01: 11:30

Yeah, well, here I take um, I love taking trains and buses. I do that all the time, or I bike. I don't like to drive around here, so I do that. And I tend to watch the people as a writer, like most, you know, like you know, we sit and watch people and they take notes. That's what we do. Um but most of the people are on their phones. Although I'm always very happy and uh feeling very refreshed when I see people, especially early in the morning, going into Brussels or Antwerp, reading books, even younger people reading, you know, secondhand books, and I love seeing that. In the States, I don't notice the reading books as much. I do notice everybody in their car, you know, often on their phone, and they tend to seem to read more American-based books. It might be stories of immigrants, which are really big right now in the States, but they're really meeting a lot, reading a lot of American um work, whereas in Europe I tend to feel like people are looking at other countries more and not just reading the literature from their own country.

SPEAKER_00: 12:21

That's interesting. And I noticed that I think we chatted a bit before we recorded, is that when I travel outside of the US, you know, the books that I see are completely different than the books that you see in the US, like if you go to bookshops. And the US tends to be very US-centric. And, you know, I'm gonna say we in the US, who've been living here for 20 years, do you think we, uh, you know, I'm also an American citizen. Do you think we are are missing out on, you know, the diverse culture that Europe has to offer through its literature because Americans, I don't want to stereotype, but in general they prefer more US-centric stories. Or maybe even the publishers actually pushing more US stories and less uh international stories.

SPEAKER_01: 13:11

Right. Well, publishing, as you know, is a business. And so there are the publishers there to make money, so are the agents, and so and the and the booksellers, you know, they're they're there to make money, and what's trending is what sells. Um, I think international, the international lens is actually getting bigger and bigger, and I think more people in the states are more interested in that. However, they tend to be reading a lot of books that are written in the United States, but maybe, like I said, like the stories about people coming in, like immigrants, and that's I think pretty big right now, what I understand. I love to go to England and I go to London or other places, and I buy the books there because I love, I just love British writers in general, you know. So I love reading the books sometimes very quirky, very different, um, subtle undertones, not so like in your face sometimes. I love humor. Also, the Irish writers, Scottish writers, I I just really kind of eat that stuff up. So I guess maybe because that's I'm based here as well. But I also, you know, explore American writers as well. It just depends on the story. It has to be a really good story, well written, and and really touch me um emotionally.

SPEAKER_00: 14:13

Who's who's big in Europe now? Like I remember when Elena Ferrente made it to the US and everyone was reading Elena Ferrente. Like these are uh, you know, Elena Ferrente, the the Italian author who wrote uh that series of books based in Napoli, if if you know her. But when it uh like everyone was reading Elena Ferrante, at least in the US. So these are like some few European, and then there is the author, Frederick, what's his last name, who wrote uh Ove, a man called Ove. Um and these are at least the the big European names that we get here in the US. What are the big names? Like who are the like the Stephen Kings of Europe now?

SPEAKER_01: 14:55

I'm not really sure. Actually, I see people reading books, but uh I know there's some here. I mean, I live in Flanders, so everything here is in Dutch. So everyone around me is reading in Dutch. And I know that some of the names, I just don't read their books because their words are so long. I speak Dutch just to or Flemish, but their words are so long, it takes me forever to get through those books. Um, so that's basically what I'm surrounded by here when I go into bookstores. Um, and then French if I go into like I live inside the right outside of Brussels in Flanders. But if I um if I go to Brussels, everything is a lot of it is in French, and they're already mainly books that are published in France in general. Some are published in Belgium, but I guess it it's different just because I'm reading a lot in English right now, so um Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 15:37

Yeah. It's it's the translation. I think for me, are we doing a good enough job to translate the books that are published in different languages and bringing them? Um so for me, like in Arabic, uh there's a lot of great books, and now there's a movement to translate them into English, and I'm actually seeing them at Bars and Noble, which is great. So when it comes to like translation, do you think we're doing enough job of bringing these stories everywhere? You know, cross-culture.

SPEAKER_01: 16:09

Yeah, I wish we did more translation because I think that does help readers really read the books. You know, I I'd love to read your books, you know. If they're written in Arabic, for example, I can't read them, but if they're translated into English, I could. Um so having more translation would be great to let people read books from other cultures as well. And and that's a process, though. I have read books that were written in French, translated into English, but really not well done. And the same thing, read books in English that were translated into French and just it really almost massacred the story. And and oftentimes the the author doesn't even know that. They, you know, they they their publisher usually is the one who hires the translator, they get them translated, and then it goes out, and then you know, they wonder why is the book not selling, and it's because it just sometimes can ruin the story. But other people like Isabella Yende, I love her books, right? And they're trans, she writes in Spanish, they're translated into English. She has a very good translator who she's been working with for years, I think, and they're just so well translated. So this story is just beautiful, like Paolo Coelho as well, his books, you know, from Brazil, they're translated into all these different languages, and they're done in such a way that you can't even tell that they've been translated, and that's the job. I was a translator for 20 years, actually. So I know a lot about translation, but I didn't do fiction or non-fiction, I actually was doing more scientific work. Okay. But it translation to me it's a very sensitive topic because some people think, oh, I can translate, but no, they can't. There's really a lot of training behind it.

SPEAKER_00: 17:38

Yeah, that's true. I just finished Kabir Garcia Marquez Love in the Time of Cholera, and I thought that translation was really good. Uh, I mean, it was it was a very long book, but I finished it. Um, not really Isama Read, but anyways. Okay, I'll I'm gonna talk about uh writing in a language that is not your own, and uh how the level of confidence and the imposter syndrome. So I I do also book coaching, and some of my clients English is not their native language, they tend to be mostly from the Middle East, and there's always this imposter syndrome that they cannot do it, and even some of them like have been living, you know, in in English-speaking countries for a long time. They're like educated in English-speaking universities, but but there is a still imposter syndrome. Uh, I mean, I got over that, but I have to admit that I had it in the past. Uh, but I I guess the older I get, I I stop caring about many things. But do you feel that the international students that want to write in a language that's not their own, especially in English, because they want to, you know, have an international audience, suffer from that imposter syndrome? And how do you help them through it?

SPEAKER_01: 19:01

Yeah, absolutely. That's a good question. They do. And I know what it's like because I actually studied in different countries, so I know it's in different languages myself. And when I would turn in papers, especially in Japan, I studied in Japan and it was all in Japanese. That was hard turning in papers and knowing that I wasn't born Japanese, so it was really hard to do. So imagine coming to the States, for example, like you, and um, you know, writing in English, and also if you're writing a book, for example, that's kind of a scary thing. And there is an imposter system, uh, imposter syndrome, and it is real. So, what I do is I help them um realize that most people have not done what they've done. Most people have not come from another culture and you know, started writing and really writing for an audience and you know, seriously taking this too. And people are worried. Sometimes they say, Well, yeah, but my writing's gonna be different, it won't sound right, you know. And I say, Well, that's your unique style, that's your voice, too. And it's okay, you know, that's what editors are for, because editors can come in and help, especially you know, copy editors. Editors or line editors or even proofreaders to help fix that. So I motivate as a coach, I motivate my um international clients especially with that, no matter what language they're they're writing in.

SPEAKER_00: 20:11

Yeah. And now with AI tools like grammar, they I mean it can catch a lot of stuff. And like for me, when when they mentioned that, and I the first thing I say, let's worry about the story now. We'll fix the grammar later. What matters now is the story, the, you know, if if it's fiction, you know, the character developments are fiction outline. We'll talk about fixing. I mean, and that that's like the easy for me, I see it. That's the easy problem to fix. The book itself, the content is the harder uh problem to fix because the other one, you can always hire a copy editor and end the end of end of the problem. All right. I wanna pivot a bit and talk about a topic that many uh writers or entrepreneurs suffer from or struggle with, let's say, it which is marketing. And so for you, whether it's marketing your book or marketing your business to get like, I guess, more more coaching clients, what is what have you been doing that you felt really worked for you, like the with the highest R ROI?

SPEAKER_01: 21:21

Well, I think when I was um so when my first book was published in 2017, and the second book was already ready to go, so the sequel came out in 2018. And then there was it was before COVID, and so I was invited to a lot of events to promote the books. Yeah. So I went um to these events and I would speak at these events. I was asked to speak, I was interviewed, you know, and I would sign the books, and that worked really well. So I went all over, and um oftentimes I initiated it. It wasn't my publisher. So I would say, oh, I'll go here and I, you know, said I would like to speak, I would like to talk about this. I was on panels um on inclusive writing, you know, in literature, inclusive representation. Um, so people from different cultures, backgrounds, ethnicities, sexual orientation, gender, that kind of thing. So I did a lot of panel work and just a lot of outreach. I did some social media and that was not comfortable for me, but I did it. I did not hire a publicist. And if you have the money, that's a great thing to do, is to hire a publicist and let them do that, especially if you're not comfortable with social media. But I would do blog posts and I was invited to really a lot of events. I did over 50 events in those first two years when my books came out. Um, and somewhere in England and most were in the United States, and somewhere in Belgium as well, in bookstores and other things. And then when COVID hit, everything stopped. I had to stop. We couldn't go do that, and that was really hard. I did do one online event, but I didn't feel like that was the same as being in person and signing books for people and giving these talks. And um, I think that's a great way to do it if you can just go out there. But most writers I know are introverts, so it's hard for them to get out there and do that. It's scary. The first time I did it, I was so scared. Uh, I remember. No, I'm not, but I was.

SPEAKER_00: 23:05

Yeah. So how do you get these picking gigs if you want to advise an author? Because you always say many authors say like their best sales were when they were actually out there. But do you reach out to organization or do they reach out to you? How like give us your secret sauce?

SPEAKER_01: 23:22

It was kind of it was kind of both. Um, the first one was a friend of mine, and I'd done some editing for her book, and her book came out right around the time mine did, my first one. And so she said, you know, and this was in the States, she goes, Well, have a gig, you know, in a library, you want to join me? And I said, Okay. So there were three of us, and that's how it started. And then I um my publisher actually arranged quite a few other ones. So I went to Boston and did some of those. And I thought while I was there, I'll just contact this bookstore. And that's kind of what I did. I went to libraries, bookstores, most of the libraries that I knew, and even those I didn't know, I drop off some books. I said, Did you take donations? I said, Oh, by the way, I don't mind speaking. Oh, really? Okay, you know, and so we would organize it that way. So I did a lot myself. Or like when I came to Brussels, I was living in California, but I came to Brussels, and I went to two major, um, two or three major bookstores, and the two of them said yes, so that I was able to present twice at each one and sell books that way. And I made I used to be a graphic designer, so I love to design stuff. So I would design stuff and then we put up flyers and uh make business cards. And so it was a lot of effort on my part, I guess. But if you if you're not a designer and you're not really that motivated, and if you have the money, then it's good to hire a publicist or somebody who can help you. Traditional publishing houses, as you know, now don't always have the budget to help, especially authors that are you know just starting out, they don't have the the capacity. And agents will help too, but the publicity part I think oftentimes falls on the the writer. So having a platform and doing a lot of uh you know social media is helpful um if you can do that.

SPEAKER_00: 25:47

So would you ever consider self-publishing?

SPEAKER_01: 25:51

I think I would. If you know, if this book now that I wrote, uh that I finished that I love, it took me seven years to write, it was it's about dance as well. And um, so I did a lot of dance, pulled a lot of muscles. Oh wow. Really fun though. So I if if I don't find a publisher, I haven't really I looked a little bit, but not really. But um I think I could, I could do that. Um yeah, I know it's actually more lucrative for many writers now. They're finding that the trends have changed and it's more lucrative actually to publish yourself. You get more money that way. So I don't know. I just like the community with a a traditional publisher, just having that community of people, the the all the authors together doing things. I just I just kind of love that. But if that doesn't work, I might publish it myself.

SPEAKER_00: 26:34

I I want to talk a bit about coaching writers. What are you thinking the main pain points that they they struggle with? Because is your coaching mindset and like accountability or do you actually edit their work?

SPEAKER_01: 26:50

I do I do both. I think the the hardest part, you were talking about imposter syndrome. And I would say most of the people who come to my coaching book coaching, it's the imposter syndrome. They feel like, who am I to write this book? Okay, you know, what is this story about? And and it's oftentimes things right like right here, behind the, you know, like this voice saying, Who do you think you are? This is rubbish, that kind of thing happens all the time. So it's a lot of time convincing them that yes, their story, you know, needs to be told if they if that's what they feel and and and how they write. So it's oftentimes helping them get the motivation to write, the discipline. Because sometimes they say, Oh, I'll do it next week, I'll do it next week. Yet we meet every week. And I say, Well, what did you do this week? And so they there's the accountability part and the motivating, and also the helping them with the self-worth aspect. I'm also a self-worth coach, so I can help them with that too. Just feeling a little bit better about writing if they have kids. For example, yes, writing is a profession, being an author is a profession, so taking that seriously, um, that kind of thing. And then also the editing part. So, on top of that, if they want a developmental editor, that's what I do. If they want copy editing, I can help with that too. Um, but basically, it's really getting them to write and to enjoy writing. And if they don't enjoy it, then I say, well, you know, maybe it's a good idea not to continue because if you're not finding joy in what you're doing, maybe there's something else you might want to do. And and they agree with me on that. Don't you agree with me on that?

SPEAKER_00: 28:15

I do, I do. I mean, uh for me, like when I when I was younger, I guess I would like when I quit writing, this this is awful, I can't do it. But then I realized that I cannot not write. And when when you reach that stage, no matter how hard you try, there is like a drive inside you that will always make you sit down and write. And I think having that drive is sometimes you just have to bring it out of people because what happens, it's is so shadowed by the self-doubt and what we tell our mind that it can paralyze people. And sometimes you need uh someone to kind of exercise these thoughts out of your head to actually make use of partner, right? It's just it's fascinating how it's it all boils down to mindset. Um, not necessarily talent or anything like that. It's you it's it's how you train your mindset. So you mentioned your your writing clients, which kind of I think it's different than people who buy your book. And uh how do you market your business so that people that potential clients can find you? Because I I honestly uh you know like struggle with that. I mean, I have uh writing or coaching business mostly focusing on on mindset. And I mostly like push stuff on social media and YouTube and whatever, but it's still I'm I'm still struggling to find clients. How what do you do to find these clients?

SPEAKER_01: 29:55

Well, it's not easy, it's true, it's not easy, especially like right now, there's a lot going on in the world, and so some people are a little bit hesitant to pay money, you know, to to do coaching. Yeah, but basically word of mouth. So for me, like I said, I've been teaching writing here in Brussels since 2006, and then I went and lived in Japan and back in the States, and so I was teaching there too. But it was people have taken a seminar of mine or a workshop or a course, and they see how I teach and how much, you know, the knowledge that I have, and then they say, Well, you know, I would like to actually, I have this project. I want to work on a book or on a this manuscript or a story. So they'll contact me that way because they've already met me in the courses and they see how how I work with people, or else it could be um just a friend of a friend, you know, or the husband of a friend, or that kind of thing. Like, oh, my husband's been wanting to write a book for a long time and he keeps saying that, but why doesn't he contact you? So the the wife might contact me, or the same thing. Um, so it's usually word of mouth, or people taking my courses, or uh, like I said, there's some I put some things on LinkedIn sometimes, just a little bit, you know, like blog posts. I I tend to write about nature a lot and how nature provides a lot of solace to me, and how I think it's very nurturing. So I'll write about that, and then writers might connect with that, and I'll put my photos up and they'll go, oh, nice photo, and then they'll contact me that way. But it is word of mouth mainly, and people I know, people who have taken my writing courses, that's basically how I've I haven't done a lot of social media, I must say.

SPEAKER_00: 31:19

Yeah, so it's not social media. I don't know. I I feel sometimes we put a lot of effort on social media. I think it's because it's cool to be on social media, but maybe at the end of the day, it's actually connections, it's not social media, but it's it's interesting. I'm like starting to learn that lesson slowly that just go offline and meet people and like and not just spend all your time, you know, fighting with Canva to create like the best image for social media posts or something like that.

SPEAKER_01: 31:49

I think it is connections because we met, like I met someone online who actually introduced us, so we met through a connection, but it was online. So if you can kind of do both, I think. But if I I know when I first um started going on social media, which I wasn't doing, and and the publicist for my publisher said to me then if you're not comfortable with Facebook or with Instagram or any of these things, don't force it. Don't force it. You know, it's okay. Don't, you know, a lot of writers aren't comfortable. And I said, Oh, good, I'm not comfortable. So I did a little bit and I do a little bit, but it it's it's not like my favorite thing. It's true. But I do know that if I have a course coming up or if I have a book coming out or something, that's really the way to reach certain people who really are online and that's how they connect. And so everyone's different, and I think respecting this difference. Some people like online, some people like in person. I'm lucky that when I go to an event, and I don't go to a lot of events recently, but when I go, I tend to sit next to the right person, apparently, and they'll go, Oh, do you have a card? And I just tend to always have my cards with me, and I'll give them my card and be like, oh, and then they'll contact me, and then there was a there's a client right there. Luckily, that happens to me all the time. And I think because years and years ago, I took a workshop, and in the workshop, somebody said, just imagine sitting next to or standing next to the person you're supposed to meet at that event, and that will happen. So before I go to an event, I oftentimes imagine standing or sitting next to the person I'm supposed to meet, and actually that happens. And the person comes to me, I don't know who they are, they ask for my card, and then they're my client. So I should probably go to more events. That is very true.

SPEAKER_00: 33:24

All right, so be before we we conclude, what is your top advice for um someone who wants to who's struggling with finishing their book? And um, whether they're in the US or international, like a universal advice that you would give someone who is really struggling to finish?

SPEAKER_01: 33:46

I would say keep going because if they had the idea of writing the book and they're already over halfway through, then actually keep going. Just keep going, maybe take a break. Sometimes, you know, you can get writer's block if you go every day and you kind of push. Go outside, like Julia Cameron said in her book, The Artist's Way, you know, go outside, do artist dates so where you can get this creativity that comes in and then do some writing about that. Or hire a book coach like you and me, you know, who we're here for the accountability part, but also the motivation part. And also we might spot errors or something that needs to be changed in the book, or just advising them on how they write. So just not give up because so many people want to write books and so many people don't write the book. And when they start, many people don't finish. So it's it's already a huge daunting thing. Maybe starting with short stories or you know, that that's helpful, or poems even, and then working towards the book.

SPEAKER_00: 34:43

Yeah, yeah. Well, um, this is great. And how can people reach you? Um, you know, if they want to hire you as a coach or read your books, what's the best way to reach you, Ann?

SPEAKER_01: 34:52

I think the best way is probably either on LinkedIn, so at Cross Culture Horizons, so uh under my name, Ann Randerson, and you know, Cross Culture Horizons is my um website.com. But also they can um yeah, send me an email as well. And we can put the email in the in the notes if you'd like. And then um sure. Yeah, we'll do that. Yeah, in the show notes, yeah. Either way, yeah. Yeah, that's probably yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 35:16

I I don't usually put it because I don't want to spam people, but I usually I usually just link to the website.

SPEAKER_01: 35:22

Uh so uh yeah, that's what things just linking to the website, I think is best, and also under my if you if they're interested in my books, so it's Mickey Brent.com. Um, so Mickey like Mickey Mouse, people make fun of that, but it's Mickey Brent.com.

SPEAKER_00: 35:37

No, I I like it, and I I I love that it's set like in different uh international settings. It's fun, it like gives people the vibe of their onification, which is nice.

SPEAKER_01: 35:47

Yeah, they are, and when they people have read the books and they've gone to Brussels and they said, Wow, it's just like in the books, you know, and it is because I lived there for so long and I wrote the book riding on my bicycle. I rode through the streets all the time and then I would love to rain, because it rains a lot here, but um very European, very European of you.

SPEAKER_00: 36:06

Thank you. On your bicycle. All right. Uh so um this has been wonderful. Thank you so much for your time. And um, you know, I enjoyed our chat, and I'm sure um, you know, the audience will love your tips and would love to connect with you. And for anyone who's listening or watching, thank you for joining us for another episode of Read and Write with Natasha. And until we meet again.

SPEAKER_01: 36:30

Thanks, Natasha. Bye bye.

SPEAKER_00: 36:32

Ciao. Thank you for tuning in to Read and Write with Natasha. I'm your host, Natasha Tony. If today's episode inspired you in any way, please take the time to review the podcast. Remember to subscribe and share this podcast with a fellow book lovers. Until next time. Happy reading. Happy writing.